[Paul]

Wondering your thoughts on whether i should move over to a new imac or stick to using the pc most of the time. In the work we were thinking about getting macs to work as they are "considered" better to work on for webby stuff?? I have also heard working with photoshop, etc is far easier on a mac??

Are macs better to use and work with in general? are they worth the extra cash compared to a pc? Would it be worth the extra expense with software as well?

at the moment, i have a pc with 19" and 22" (wide) screens, 2.4ghz amd athlon CPU, 350gb drive, 4gb ram, 256mb graphics

we are considering the new imac
Intel Core 2 Duo Processor
2.4GHz Processor Speed
1GB Memory
320GB Hard Disk
24'' Widescreen Aluminium display
(would upgrade to at least 2gb ram)

let me know your thoughts. Ideally not from daft mac heads, I know what you'll say

[pgo]

Originally Posted by karloff

they are "considered" better to work on for webby stuff??

Not really. They're no better or worse. Some might argue that Windows or Linux is more geared to a server/IT sort of environment.

Originally Posted by karloff

I have also heard working with photoshop, etc is far easier on a mac??

It's the exact same software and works exactly the same on both systems. I believe typeface management is easier on Macs.

Originally Posted by karloff

Are macs better to use and work with in general? are they worth the extra cash compared to a pc? Would it be worth the extra expense with software as well?

My opinion of each of these is "no", but that's me. I'm not a Windows fanboy, but it works for me because I'm too lazy and uninterested to learn Linux.

[Do Gooder]

if you really know your windows machines well - it could be to stick with them rather than learn a new system.

spec for spec i don't think there's much in it speed wise.... the OS boots very fast on a mac... but that hardly means anything.

For me it's about productivity and longevity. due to the same company making the os and hardware (and caring about it somewhat fanatically) macs systems can run very smoothly and last a long time - I generally spend less time nursing sick macs - that time is spent working instead (or eating buscuits).

a soft way into the world of macs is installing windows - so you can always creep back! but that only adds to the costs as you need to get the windows software.

If you already got the two screens you could look at the mac mini. the shared graphics are shit for games/3d graphics... but make little odds on everyday work... cheap way in

Also just a wee thing.. a mac can hold it's value better - i could sell my laptop i bought in early 2002 for an average of £350 on ebay. very much doubt an equivilant pc from 6 years ago would fetch such a price.

[Paul]

cheers mate, its not about holding value ... like i said its for the work(me no pay)

i do use my mac book pro and wouldn't find it hard switchin to a new system, just trying to find out if in general if mac programs for webby stuff are better. I have heard about textmate and many other bits of software that are really good. Basically we are making the decision very soon so i need to decide.

i'll still have window pc for sage and other stuff which mac can't run.

[Paul]

Originally Posted by pgo

Not really. They're no better or worse. Some might argue that Windows or Linux is more geared to a server/IT sort of environment.

It's the exact same software and works exactly the same on both systems. I believe typeface management is easier on Macs.

My opinion of each of these is "no", but that's me. I'm not a Windows fanboy, but it works for me because I'm too lazy and uninterested to learn Linux.

i use linux aswell (well very badly) and i work in an IT dept so most stuff is windows.

all fair points, cheers p

[freelancr]

Every PC/Windows laptop I have ever had come across has been designed badly and made out of the cheapest possible components. I am the geek in a large family, and am always asked to fix their computers, or their friends computers, and usually their laptops last about 18 months on average.

So far they have been through:

• Toshiba - Battery wouldn't hold a charge after 14 months, the replacement battery would of cost more than a new laptop to replace.
• Advent - Bricked itself in about 15 months. I suspect it had been dropped.
• Dell - Someone tripped over the power cord and ripped the arsehole out of the motherboard, Dell wanted £500 to replace the motherboard on a computer that was 18 months old, when they are selling new ones for less than that. They wouldn't supply a replacement motherboard, so I bought one from ebay and fitted it myself, this then died of natural causes a few months later - I suspect I bought it from some cunt with a dying laptop that was broken up for spares. If Dell used the same magnetic power cords that Apple use, this would not have happened.
• Any PC/Windows - The operating system gets fucked over by a million and one viruses.
• Acer - Overheated and died.

And those are just the ones I can remember, that I wasn't able to fix. Always, without fail, a PC laptop someone I know has bought, will die about 6 months after the warranty expires. I worked in Staples many moons ago, and by god the amount of returns we had in just because the fucking idiots cocked up windows was unbelievable.

I am saving up for a Macbook Pro because they have been well thought out and look the dogs bollocks. As OSX is unix based it is able to run most of the open source software available to Linux natively. They also have the option of running Windows or Linux as a virtual machine or on another partition. They trump Linux as they can run Adobe CS3.

I currently use an old Dell laptop and run CentOS 5.1 (Linux), this is great for development, but Adobe probably won't ever support Linux, and its about time I saved up for CS3 and learnt the ropes.

[RaelRode]

Personally, I cannot do PHP stuff on my mac. I have found setting up a webserver on here with PHP/MySQL so hard, I haven't even bothered.

In regards to Photoshop and other CS3 apps, they're all the same so not much different apart from you can show off with a mac whereas every tom, dick and harry has a windows machine.

[Kev]

Originally Posted by RaelRode

I have found setting up a webserver on here with PHP/MySQL so hard

Try MAMP for local development on a mac.

[freelancr]

In theory setting up PHP should be easier on a Mac than Windows, though I'm guessing you are installing a complete WAMP application on your Windows box - it achieves the desired result but teaches you nothing, which is why you are struggling to install it on the Mac. Though I fear there may also be MAMP applications out there too.

MySQL is a doddle to setup on any operating system. They ship installers for every OS ffs!

[RaelRode]

Ok, PHP is easy to set-up on the mac, just a case of ticking a box and hey presto!!

I didn't find any articles on getting MySQL up though, will check out the site on friday.

[iblastoff]

some people will swear by macs and claim 'the workflow' is just so much faster. its not a very convincing argument. mac products are just overpriced for what they are and are only made up for by their resale value.

i've run xp ever since it came out with no issues of viruses/spyware/etc etc etc. i don't even keep any antivirus/spyware software in memory. firewall is taken care of by the router. as long as you're not a moron, windows machines work just fine (and so do macs. but saying one is 'better' than the other is just silly and reeks of lame fanboyism)

[illvibe]

It's true - windows will pretty much do everything that OSX will. For me, if I were to design an OS, it would probably be more like OSX than Windows, so that's what works for me.

It might be a weak point, but as designers we like to surround ourselves with nice looking things in the hope some of that will rub off onto our work. If nothing else, Macs look and feel nicer to use which is actually a high priority for some people.

[freelancr]

I agree with the general point of your post in that if you do run freeporn.exe, you deserve to get a virus, and by being sensible you can avoid most problems... but what I do not agree to is the first part of your post...

Originally Posted by iblastoff

i've run xp ever since it came out with no issues of viruses/spyware/etc etc etc. i don't even keep any antivirus/spyware software in memory.

So you don't have any anti-virus or spyware prevention, nor a software firewall? Yet you haven't noticed anything wrong, so your system must be clean? Sigh... it's akin to saying you can fuck as many people as you like without a condom, but you don't have HIV because you have never been tested, then BAM - 10 years later you die of a cold!

A Hardware firewall on your router is good, but it wont stop a virus from using your PC as a spam zombie, or stop someone from using a Trojan against you to gain control over your computer. Hardware firewalls have rules on which ports are visible to computers outside the network it is protecting - but usually they allow all outgoing connections from your PC. Whereas a software firewall would alert you to outgoing connections too, so you can deny the application if you aren't using it, then find it and remove it.

[Hunch]

My main workstation was a PC for about 18 years before I decided to switch to a Mac in the middle of last year. However I've used Mac OS, *nix and Windows with regularly throughout that period.

Has my productivity improved? Yes considerably. As a designer/developer who spends probably an equal amount of time on graphics/coding the Mac offers a better development platform for the way I work. Previously I used a PC for Adobe/Macromedia (as it was then) and a second Linux machine box with samba shares/terminals for developing the site itself. Now everything runs sweetly in a single environment.

Speaking as an old Unix blowhard, the fact that Mac OS is certified Unix gives so much power and flexibility to be able to drop into a shell terminal anytime I want to do anything complicated or just the 'old fashioned' way. This is one area where the underlying OS is simply incomparable to Windows which has none of this functionality.

Raelrode: Go here. living-e AG: MAMP - Mac - Apache - MySQL - PHP

Download it, follow the simple installer and you're done. There's simply no need to have any hassles with a Mysql/PHP/Apache setup. If you're going to use it a lot, I'd probably splash out on the Pro version - the control panel makes everything a doddle.

Should you switch to Mac if you're a lifelong PC user? Well there's no real risk other than Apple's slightly higher hardware costs, because Macs run Windows now, so if you had a nightmare, you could just install XP.

It's not just web development though. The basic OS itself just has so many features that leave windows standing.

• Want to uninstall an application? Just drag its icon to the waste basket. That's it.
• Don't want the hassle of organizing a backup regime? Time Machine just does it for you with a couple of clicks.
• Can't find something? Spotlight will show you everything on your system matching your keywords at the speed you type. No waiting around for it to be found.

I could go on. The point is, it's relatively easy to find areas where Mac OS significantly outperforms Windows (I won't bang on about viruses/malware because it's been done to death). However finding places where Windows does better than Mac OS is relatively hard. Even the old one about "there's more software for Windows" is becoming irrelevant except in the area of games, and even games aren't so much of an issue now you can dual boot. I'd challenge anyone to tell me about a freeware app for Windows for which there isn't an equal or better Mac alternative.

[illvibe]

I've found since installing Leopard, I haven't been able to get MAMP working again.

[rglover]

Although I'm a PC user, I do use a Mac at work. To be honest, I like the mac a lot better for web stuff. Software like Coda, which is unavailable on PC make stuff go a lot faster. I guess as far as performance goes Mac & PC are about the same, but as far as quality of components, and ease of use, Mac's are great. It all depends on what you want to spend/downtime learning the new system.

[pgo]

I think the consensus is that it doesn't matter. Personal preference and all that.

The only thing I've ever had trouble with - Windows-wise - was installing a web server on Vista for development. I finally got it to work using WampServer after trying raw installs of each and XAMPP, which after my initial experiences with WampServer is a bloated mess. Credit to herkalees for turning me on to it!

For development, I use phpDesigner 2007. I've no reason to upgrade it to 2008, though.

[Paddy]

Coda is great, and I don't use textmate, but could I just point out another thing that hasn't been mentioned yet, since you asked about the new iMac.

Those things are gorgeous. Totally wipe the floor, in terms of design, with any other desktop PC.

[Hunch]

Originally Posted by illvibe

I've found since installing Leopard, I haven't been able to get MAMP working again.

Works flawlessly for me. Have you downloaded the latest version?

[cam]

Mac.