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Old 05-04-2012, 10:03   #1 (permalink)
Signum
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Paying To Work For Free

With all the furore going on recently about Tesco and the like taking advantage of the unemployed to come and work for free, this caught my attention. Imagine if you had to pay someone for that privilege for coming to work for free at their company.

A VFX company called Digital Domain are offering students the opportunity to work for free on their productions. But the students will have to pay them. $105,000 a year. What the fuck.

That's not all. If you've not heard of Digital Domain, they are a company that do a lot of VFX work for big budget film and TV. They're massive, with offices across the world. So imagine the horror when people discover they are getting SUBSIDY from the government to the tune of $80 million for their promise of high tech jobs.

It's a fucking joke. If this is some how a 'success' and people sign up to this shit it sets an ungodly precedent, not just for the VFX industry but for the creative industry as a whole. The fucking arrogance of these people is astonishing.

Read more about this shit here and here.
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:35   #2 (permalink)
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I don't see anything wrong with this.

I guess you can complain about the subsidy, but ultimately "eh."
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:47   #3 (permalink)
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So working for free is OK then?
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:49   #4 (permalink)
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Doing that would mean more to your future career prospects than going to university.

Not exactly free, especially in an industry where I'm sure there are a lot of people with parents with more money than sense.
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:59   #5 (permalink)
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Well seeing as its government subsidised, don't you think it's bullshit that they are charging a huge amount of money -basically pricing out those who haven't got a spare $130,000.

And what makes you think that the VFX industry is filled with people that have rich parents?

People complain about spec work on here all the time, I don't see how this is more acceptable.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:05   #6 (permalink)
Dan_Dan249
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teapoted
Doing that would mean more to your future career prospects than going to university.

Really though? Guaranteed? In writing? With certification?

Suspect.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:11   #7 (permalink)
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What if the price was $5,000 per year? Would it still be ridiculous to charge people (without experience) to work with academy award winning special effects artists?

I don't think so, I'd do that over going to uni. And the price quite frankly is irrelevant, because $5,000 to me is as distant to some as 100k is to others.

I'm basing this on that they are actually going to work though, if they pay 100k to fetch coffee, then yes that's sad.

Spec work isn't the same, spec work is expecting free work (without risk to the client) from professionals. To be honest I don't have a problem with that either, I don't do it, but I don't have a problem with it.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:22   #8 (permalink)
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Hmm not sure it works when you create an argument (in the discourse/dialectical sense) by adjusting the price to something completely reasonable like 5k and then in the next sentence dismissing price entirely as something 'irrelevant' by linking it to your own situation.

The point of objection in this case is linked to the price and the idea that people would be asked to pay and work. This is usually the reversed (people working to get paid). Honestly I think the people who sign up to do it will have some good opportunities put their way (possibly better than what you'd get by attending university, but only 'possibly'). My real issue here is like I'd mentioned, there doesn't seem to be any guarantee, like what you'd get if you were to attend an IVY league university. Plus of course there are plenty of social connections you'd attain by attending those types of universities.

I'm interested to see if this scheme actually attracts any people.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:24   #9 (permalink)
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I adjusted the price just to say that it's irrelevant. As it's too much for me currently, but not for others. And the same applies to university fees, and you're not guaranteed to get a good education there either.

(then again I'm also against universities)
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:26   #10 (permalink)
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You are guaranteed to go far in life. If you have money.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:28   #11 (permalink)
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argh trade unions what a concept praps theyl be reborn in the cyberworlds
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:30   #12 (permalink)
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Lol at first glance Sub I was thinking 'Wise Words'. Then I thought, well, define 'far'. MJ and Whitney went 'far' didn't they?

Ian - Why are you 'against' universities? Why not all forms of educational institutions? Or is it specifically just universities? What's the story here? Bad lecturer? Did he/she/heshe..do things?

Demt matey are you slowly turning into a spam bot?
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:33   #13 (permalink)
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I mean universities in the field of design. Visual Effects might be on the edge of that and be technical enough to warrant a University education, but ultimately I don't know anyone who improved in 3-4 years in a Uni as much as they could have without.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:36   #14 (permalink)
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Fair do's. I can't comment as I'm based in the humanities/social sciences.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:37   #15 (permalink)
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That's a useful degree.

...
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:38   #16 (permalink)
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Um, that's not a degree, that's a faculty. Well, two actually.

...
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:38   #17 (permalink)
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pls dan.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:40   #18 (permalink)
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fak u.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:46   #19 (permalink)
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i may be a spam bot but i wish i knew whos paying me
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:53   #20 (permalink)
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You raise some interesting points Teapoted. I think I came at this thinking that this would be something people did AFTER graduating from their degree, but I suppose if it was a replacement then I can see how it could benefit some people. I agree with you that industry experience is infinitely more valuable than stuff you learn at uni.

However, think of it like this - these guys aren't going to be let loose on the big stuff, they'll be doing all the donkey work. Rotoscoping, stereo conversions etc. Are there any guarantees that they'll be learning anything more than that? Sure they might 'pick up' a few bits and pieces while moping around the office but there's no curriculum, no regulation. DD can show them as little or as much as they like.

Digital Domain are getting free, obedient little pack horses that will accept whatever work their given for no wages and be grateful for it. Sounds like ideal employees to me! Also not to mention that there might be professionals put out of work because of the lack of jobs higher up the chain.
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