[Hunch]

IEBlog : Microsoft's Interoperability Principles and IE8

Interesting. Something that should be music to the ears of web designers if they follow through on it. In a nutshell IE8 will operate in standards compliant mode by default, without needing the 'standards mode' tag previously suggested.

[pgo]

Saw this earlier and it's great news. Glad to see Microsoft is listening to us - even if it took 8 years.

Nice that their new version targeting system won't be needed by default it seems.

[hawken]

so now websites made to work in previous versions of IE will be cast off like a ginger haired step child, thus providing us with more work!

horay!

[pgo]

Either that or people will set their outdated sites to render in IE6 mode.

[haku]

If most people have stopped supporting IE 5.5 and below as of IE7, then why don't we stop supporting IE6 when IE8 comes out!

[Hunch]

Originally Posted by pgo

Either that or people will set their outdated sites to render in IE6 mode.

Or (and I admit this is wishful thinking) when the earlier versions' browser share dies to a tiny percentage, people could eventually go back and edit out all the IE6/IE7 quirks so that it simply works with all the current generation standards compliant browsers.

Originally Posted by haku

If most people have stopped supporting IE 5.5 and below as of IE7, then why don't we stop supporting IE6 when IE8 comes out!

I think that will inevitably happen within 12 months of IE8 being out.

[hawken]

What about the African children!!

Why don't microsoft think of the developing world.

etc

[woodss]

Great news! They've only done it to stop shooting themselves in the foot though; noone would've enabled IE8 standards mode anyway if it was gonna fuck everything that was already up and running.

[pgo]

Originally Posted by haku

If most people have stopped supporting IE 5.5 and below as of IE7, then why don't we stop supporting IE6 when IE8 comes out!

I wish this were the case as well, but I think it'll be a force to reckon with for a while. Vista adoption isn't going too fast and if MS releases IE8 for Vista only then it'll be a long time before IE6 is gone completely. Is there any word on whether IE8 will be released on XP? Hopefully they'll release it as a critical update through Windows Update.

[Agricola]

step in right direction, but I wont start getting excited or be impressed until they interpret XML as XML and not text, then we can use the doctype application/xhtml+xml straight instead of making a song and dance routine to detect if browser accepts XML, inwhich case serve as XML, otherwise if it dosnt, then serve as text etc.

[niggle]

Don't worry so much about it.

You've all found tiny glitches to blow up into website-wrecking disasters up till now and I'm sure you'll find something else to whine about once they're solved.

There's no reason at all to worry that you might end up having so few microscopic technical problems to bitch about that you might actually have to consider things like user experience and whether what you make actually does its job. You've ignored them until now and I'm sure you'll continue to do so.

[d*d]

Originally Posted by niggle

There's no reason at all to worry that you might end up having so few microscopic technical problems to bitch about that you might actually have to consider things like user experience and whether what you make actually does its job. You've ignored them until now and I'm sure you'll continue to do so.

oooh, you bitch

[Hunch]

Nope - just his usual brand of being an arrogant cunt, who despite having no knowledge of the working practices of anyone on this forum, continues to demonstrate his complete lack of ability to socially interact with other people (despite his constant boasts about what a great professional he is).

Personally I think it's about time this troll was banned. It's ruining a good forum having to read his shit all the time.

[hawken]

and ruin the entertainment value. I like it how any topic imaginable ends up in a niggle train wreak.

Recently there was a windows update that tried to eradicate ie6 in favor of ie7 but it was an option, to which most people clicked "no".

IMHO it should be a forced update.

Niggle - we moan about standards. Every industry has standards, so should the basic way websites appear to users. Gradually this is changing for the better and most of my work displays fine in ie7, no changes needed, time saved, everyone happy.

you do want to be happy, right?

[niggle]

IMHO it should be a forced update.

Maybe so. But it strikes me that there's a marked lack of consistency in many people's thinking on this: we hear them say that browser updates should be forced and yet bend over backwards to accommodate those who won't.

Niggle - we moan about standards.

No, really?

Yes, I'd noticed. In particular I've noticed that when someone asks for their site to be critiqued, there's a rush to analyse the source code, validate it, check the CSS, try it in every browser and pick it pieces - yet almost nobody seems to be interested in the quality of the user experience or whether the site does what it's meant to in a campaign setting.

Users are just not interested in the source code, validation, doctypes or workarounds. They'll forgive a whole host of oddities and quirks if the site gives them what they want. That's what makes them happy, and if more of us concentrated on that instead of technical minutiae I expect we;d be happier too.

[cam]

Originally Posted by Hunch

Nope - just his usual brand of being an arrogant cunt, who despite having no knowledge of the working practices of anyone on this forum, continues to demonstrate his complete lack of ability to socially interact with other people (despite his constant boasts about what a great professional he is).

Personally I think it's about time this troll was banned. It's ruining a good forum having to read his shit all the time.

I don't know what he's been like elsewhere, but the two threads I've read so far - this and the javascript being disabled one - he's made some good arguments on not being overly fixated on technical details at the expense of the final ouput.

And he's right about the showcase section being too focused on validation at times.

[Hunch]

Yeah, thanks a lot cam - he's going to be fucking unbearable now. I don't have any particular quarrel with some of the points he makes. It's the attitude that is the problem.

[Dusteh]

there's a marked lack of consistency in many people's thinking on this: we hear them say that browser updates should be forced and yet bend over backwards to accommodate those who won't.

Please reread what you just said carefully niggle, and tell me you can see the flaw in your argument there? If you can't spot that then there really is no hope for you.

I don't know what he's been like elsewhere

*cough*First try at 3D*cough*

[hawken]

Originally Posted by niggle

yet almost nobody seems to be interested in the quality of the user experience or whether the site does what it's meant to in a campaign setting.

Users are just not interested in the source code, validation, doctypes or workarounds.

The majority of people here work in a team niggle.

There's not many one man band websites for bigger clients, we are just concerned about the part that concerns us.

So what if programmers are not interested in user experience. Thats not their job. Their job is to make the damn website work, and ie has long been a thorn in our sides.

[niggle]

we are just concerned about the part that concerns us.

So what if programmers are not interested in user experience.

Is this programmerstalk.com?